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Talk:South Continent
Is there any indication of how the South Continent is governed? Are there any Counts appointed to the South? Do South Continent citizens have loyalty oaths to their supposed District Counts back in the North? Westbrook (talk) 18:20, April 4, 2013 (UTC) The only info I can come up with from textev (I don't know any specific authorial statements) is: # There are "rural" Vor on the continent, but no mention of counts. Coming over to the South Continent right after the end of the Cetagandan Invasion makes one a "crusty old frontier" person. (ACC) # The South Continent is personal property of the Emperor, which ought to rule out the presence of districts on it. Also, Tej in CVA speaks of "Sixty-times-four plus South Continent" for places that dialects can be recognized as coming from. # There is an Imperial Lands Distribution Committee that oversees who gets given what chunks of land; Count Vortala and Minister Vann are both on that committee. KarenHunt (talk) 22:49, April 4, 2013 (UTC) oops - I put this comment under District Count: A bit more thought has gone by... I don't see any textev that backs up my claim that the South Continent is owned by the emperor of Barrayar, unless a claim in The Vorkosigan Companion counts, and I haven't committed myself to the belief that it does. There is a clear statement that Gregor owns Sergyar (in Komarr, during conversation with Tuomonen about Gregor's marriage to Laisa), but all I have for the South Continent is that there are definitely no Count's Districts on it (Captain Vorpatril's Alliance, chapter 3 has "The Counts of Barrayar were the chiefs of their clans, each commanding a major territorial District on the north continent of their planet" as well as what I mentioned about sixty-times-four. KarenHunt (talk) 23:59, April 4, 2013 (UTC) In Komarr Chaper 12, Auditor Vorthys states that Ekaterin's father, Shasha Vorvayne, and Tien's father (Nikolai Vorsoisson) were both officers in the District government and that Tien's first job after the military was in the District civil service. Since both families reside on the South Continent, it follows that there are Districts on the South Continent. Ekaterin also mentions to Miles in Chapter 5 that her father was a minor provincial bureaucrat and a rural Vor. I would note that while a Count is described as commanding a major territorial District on the north continent, a Count may still have control of a minor District on the sparsley populated South Continent. That would follow if the original settlers came from a Count's District as a colony supported by the Count. Conversely, if the "provincial" is taken literally, the South Continent could be an Imperial Province divided into Districts as the Province was settled. An historical example is the "Territory Northwest of the River Ohio", controlled by the United States. Counties were formed when population reached sufficient levels - the first being Washington County in Marietta. 06:30, April 8, 2013 (UTC)DouglasPayne Good observation... I'm not sure what should go into the article in terms of government, but if either of you want to make a try at it, I'd be happy to have something there. Some statements might have to go under a Speculations subheader, but that's the only real caveat I can see. (If nobody else tries something here, I'll take my best guess myself in a couple of weeks, when I get to it - currently I'm trying to clear out the backlog of articles for characters from the older books, working out a rewrite of the plot summary for _Barrayar_, and then hit up any characters from Captain Vorpatril's Alliance that haven't been taken care of yet. There are also a few more articles for space stations I want to add... So many tasks, but the site is beginning to look like a real resource now!) KarenHunt (talk) 10:33, April 8, 2013 (UTC) In Komarr Chapter 19 there is also reference to Tien Vorsoisson's "District liege lord" (because Tien's nerve disruptor was not issued to him by the liege lord and therefore illegal). 22:28, April 8, 2013 (UTC)DouglasPayne Yes, indeed. Well, I'll certainly listen to a claim that chunks of South Continent have been handed out as sub-Districts for certain counts. (The ones who come up with competent usage plans, perhaps?) KarenHunt (talk) 22:36, April 8, 2013 (UTC) The sub-Districts is a good possibility, especially if they are handed out as Imperial favors (And if the Vorkosigans had a few more relatives, they might be given one). There are two other options that seem most prevalent: Gregor has raised some of the rural Vor to the level of High Vor and effectively made them Counts without the title, or there are Counts on the South Continent and we simply aren't told. Westbrook (talk) 02:54, April 9, 2013 (UTC) Hm. Yes. I don't like the "there are counts we aren't told about" possibility because Tej should have noted something when she was studying Barrayar; she had two chances to say something and didn't. Besides, the Joint Council, with both Counts and Ministers (75 people according to _Barrayar_; 60 counts + 15 ministers), should include them. Unless they're under a ministry (Ministry of Southern Count, District X?), they're being left out of their government. Another possibility is that Gregor is their count - they are an extension of the Vorbarra District. I'm not totally happy with that theory, though. Mostly it's just that I'd think it'd be said a bit more clearly if that were the case. The references in _Komarr_ cited above had multiple opportunities to specify Vorbarra, and never took them... KarenHunt (talk) 10:57, April 9, 2013 (UTC)